Curse

Ollj · Jul 26, 2005, 10:27 AM // 10:27

In theory PvE chars can do better than PvP chars because they can change their headgear during battle.
This is really usefull for all "11,11,10,1" and "12,12,2" builds. They have +4 (or +3 with - 1 for the minor rune) atribute-levels to swap around.

They also could buy fissure armor to keep their armor class a secret because they look all the same?

The question is, is this peanuts compared to customized maxdamage collectors items with a flexible build or does it give an unfair advantage if PvE can change their armor depending to the situation while PvP chars cant?

That PvP chars have only 2 weapons with them is no big deal, because they still can use uncustomized PvE items with them, and +20% damage is nothing!!!

In my opinion (not a suggestion) the armor of PvE chars in PvP should be locked, so they can not change it in the battle.

TheArrow · Jul 26, 2005, 10:43 AM // 10:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

In theory PvE chars can do better than PvP chars because they can change their headgear during battle.
This is really usefull for all "11,11,10,1" and "12,12,2" builds. They have +4 (or +3 with - 1 for the minor rune) atribute-levels to swap around.

They also could buy fissure armor to keep their armor class a secret because they look all the same?

The question is, is this peanuts compared to customized maxdamage collectors items with a flexible build or does it give an unfair advantage if PvE can change their armor depending to the situation while PvP chars cant?

That PvP chars have only 2 weapons with them is no big deal, because they still can use uncustomized PvE items with them, and +20% damage is nothing!!!

In my opinion (not a suggestion) the armor of PvE chars in PvP should be locked, so they can not change it in the battle.

Seriously what the hell are you spewing on about? A pvp character can only be made with one set of armor, you can't change it. Why would I want to spend time trying to switch my armor if I decided to use a pve toon in pvp anyways?

Phades · Jul 26, 2005, 10:47 AM // 10:47

It would be because your character build would only be good if you had 3 different hats and you didnt specialize your skill bar, so that one point was enough to earn you extra seconds or 2-3 damage per spell used. Far more simple to just shift the points around in the character screen though.

Weezer_Blue · Jul 26, 2005, 11:00 AM // 11:00

While you have a point, there's never been a time when I was playing that I thought "damn! I wish I could change 1 of my attribute levels from Divine Favor to Healing Prayers! If only I could change that 1 attribute!

... in any case, if you wanted to, there's nothing to stop you from doing it with attribute points.

in conclusion. it could be done, but there's no reason for doing it. so PvP characters still, and always have > PvE characters. Not only because of the perfect weapons, but also in pure flexibility, and the fact that they get access to everything you've unlocked, not just everything you posess.

Auntie I · Jul 26, 2005, 11:27 AM // 11:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weezer_Blue

While you have a point, there's never been a time when I was playing that I thought "damn! I wish I could change 1 of my attribute levels from Divine Favor to Healing Prayers! If only I could change that 1 attribute!

... in any case, if you wanted to, there's nothing to stop you from doing it with attribute points.

in conclusion. it could be done, but there's no reason for doing it. so PvP characters still, and always have > PvE characters. Not only because of the perfect weapons, but also in pure flexibility, and the fact that they get access to everything you've unlocked, not just everything you posess.

I agree with Weezer on this. In fact if you want to change your PvP character just re-make it. It's easy and only takes a couple of minutes.

Eonwe · Jul 26, 2005, 12:24 PM // 12:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

In theory PvE chars can do better than PvP chars because they can change their headgear during battle.
This is really usefull for all "11,11,10,1" and "12,12,2" builds. They have +4 (or +3 with - 1 for the minor rune) atribute-levels to swap around.

So you're considering running two different superior runes on a charcter so that you can switch their hat to get the attribute to 16? Why? If that's not what you're trying to say, then I have no clue what you actually are trying to say.

Quote:

The question is, is this peanuts compared to customized maxdamage collectors items with a flexible build or does it give an unfair advantage if PvE can change their armor depending to the situation while PvP chars cant?

No, it doesn't give any considerable advantage at all. If you want to waste your time switching your armor for some reason during a fight then go right ahead.

Quote:

That PvP chars have only 2 weapons with them is no big deal, because they still can use uncustomized PvE items with them, and +20% damage is nothing!!!

How can you say +20% damage is nothing.... just curious.

Lorelei · Jul 26, 2005, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Quote:

The question is, is this peanuts compared to customized maxdamage collectors items with a flexible build or does it give an unfair advantage if PvE can change their armor depending to the situation while PvP chars cant?

Can a PvE character ever meet a PvP character? I thought you couldn't do that. So, I don't know how to compare PvE and PvP, or which one is more advantageous.

Tigris Of Gaul · Jul 26, 2005, 03:09 PM // 15:09

Attribute switching hardly matters because the skill set is still the same.

Phades · Jul 26, 2005, 03:09 PM // 15:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lorelei

Can a PvE character ever meet a PvP character? I thought you couldn't do that. So, I don't know how to compare PvE and PvP, or which one is more advantageous.

Storage areas within the pvp staging areas allow for the transfer of items, but armor is linked to the character it is crafted for. PvE characters can enter the pvp staging areas and participate within pvp. Speaking to the arena guards will accomplish the transition between the two. So, there are plenty of ways to transition between pvp and pve through either items or character interaction.

The Ages · Jul 26, 2005, 03:13 PM // 15:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lorelei

Can a PvE character ever meet a PvP character? I thought you couldn't do that. So, I don't know how to compare PvE and PvP, or which one is more advantageous.

Yes they can meet, a PvE Toon can go any place even the arenas where PvP Players are restricted to.

On to the topic, Sure they can but I would love to see them try to gear swap multipull times mid fight with any Success. Because its not really feasible to do it I dont see why it should be blocked in anyway.

Mithie · Jul 26, 2005, 03:15 PM // 15:15

You could probably do it with macros, but even so, the PVP char's flexibility with equip + skills will always win out in the end.

thorizdin · Jul 26, 2005, 04:10 PM // 16:10

Actually, this happens regularly in upper level GvG. PvE characters are potentially more powerful that PvP characters because of this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tigris Of Gaul

Attribute switching hardly matters because the skill set is still the same.

This is incorrect, creative uses of Arcane Mimicry give more flexibility in battle. Arcane Thievery can as well, but its much less predictable.

Meeker · Jul 26, 2005, 04:26 PM // 16:26

I could see a huge advantage to doing this as a monk. Put only on your helm with +4 divine and cast boon then switch to your +4 healing or prot helm.

I do this a lot in PvE when I have more time to switch things around and would do it in PvP is they ever made a collector prot staff so I did not need to roll a PvP char to get a decent weapon.

Cymmina · Jul 26, 2005, 09:33 PM // 21:33

I run a 10/10/9/7 (+sup domination rune) build, so I keep 3 masks on my mesmer. If I'm using a build that has Ether Lord, I switch to the +1 inspiration mask to get +3 regen... if I want a 7 second Blackout, I switch to the +1 domination mask. I don't switch in battle. For my ranger, though, I'd never want any mask other than +1 expertise because I'm quite fond of having 14 expertise.

I guess it just depends on the character as to whether or not you need the flexibility of swapping out headgear.

Algren Cole · Jul 26, 2005, 09:37 PM // 21:37

not that it's relative....well actually it is relative to the conversation. I think what he is getting at is the Monk Smite Build for UW....where you have 16 protection prayers to cast a mending enchant then switch the attributes to divine favor...

just because nobody has thought of a build that exploits this feature doesn't mean that there isn't one out there. you'd be able to hot-switch your attribute points mid battle...this could DEFINATELY give you an advantage if you used it correctly.

Lorelei · Jul 26, 2005, 09:43 PM // 21:43

Incentive to play PvE?

Warskull · Jul 27, 2005, 02:13 AM // 02:13

PvP characters will always be best for PvP. You can swap headgear for points with PvE characters, but if a new build comes along that negates your role you have no recourse with PvE. You would need to run through the entire game, recap elites, remake your armor, gather your runes again, and so on with a PvE char. If you have a PvP slot you just remake a PvP character.

Ollj · Jul 27, 2005, 03:04 AM // 03:04

its really amusing how you talk about the flexibility advantage of PvP characters when theres only 4 different builds in the toms all day long

and you have to leave the battle to change self.

hydrak · Jul 27, 2005, 03:52 AM // 03:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

In theory PvE chars can do better than PvP chars because they can change their headgear during battle.
This is really usefull for all "11,11,10,1" and "12,12,2" builds. They have +4 (or +3 with - 1 for the minor rune) atribute-levels to swap around.

They also could buy fissure armor to keep their armor class a secret because they look all the same?

The question is, is this peanuts compared to customized maxdamage collectors items with a flexible build or does it give an unfair advantage if PvE can change their armor depending to the situation while PvP chars cant?

That PvP chars have only 2 weapons with them is no big deal, because they still can use uncustomized PvE items with them, and +20% damage is nothing!!!
In my opinion (not a suggestion) the armor of PvE chars in PvP should be locked, so they can not change it in the battle.

You should stop crying for perfection (stats-wise) in pvp and being a hypocrite while doing so. You claimed that 20% damage is nothing, and yet you are scratching and crying for +3 more (or less) attribute points. Btw, being a pvp expert that you are, I hope you also realize that +3 attrib points are gain at a cost of 75 health.

Final point: Not having changeable headgears won't make you lose a pvp match, but a bad team will. 2 good teams with comparable skills and organizations (one with changeable headgears and one without) will go 50/50 in 20+ battles.

Puddin Tame · Jul 27, 2005, 06:11 AM // 06:11

Let's see... My PvE character has a "perfect" 5:1 vampiric short bow with 15% over 50%. I got this very easily from a collecter (well, I added the string). And 2 gold max other bows with 13% over 50%. 2% is nothing, 20% is. I haven't unlocked some of the runes on ym armour, and very few of the bow upgrades I use. PvE players can get perfect weapons from collecters, it just takes a little bit of *gasp!* exploring and adventuring with a group of friends! Not hours of solo killing the same thing!

A PvE character will always be better than a PvP character, used to their fullest potential. Only marginally though.